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Big Block Talk! Everything about swapping a big block engine into your cart!



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Old 11-03-2008, 12:47 AM   #21
shawn.m
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Default Re: 20hp Briggs "stumbles" on aceleration ?

we are just a little dusty around here during the summer.

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Old 11-03-2008, 09:17 PM   #22
todwil
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Default Re: 20hp Briggs "stumbles" on aceleration ?

Shawn your killing me Simple Green and a hose please
your cart will love you for it !!!!!
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Old 11-03-2008, 09:32 PM   #23
shawn.m
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Default Re: 20hp Briggs "stumbles" on aceleration ?

The picture is at the end of the day at outing at the kids dirt bike track. It was run REAL hard for about 3 hours.

I blow the motor off with air to get most of the dirt off the motor. It does really need a good cleaning with simple green. I need to take the valve covers off and reseal them with blue sealant as you can see they are leaking a bit.

I am also looking at moving the air filter to the rear bagwell area with 3" flex hose.
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Old 12-05-2008, 09:17 PM   #24
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Default Re: 20hp Briggs "stumbles" on aceleration ?

The car has run so bad for day's I was ashamed to try to sell it. Ok, here's what I've learned (from some very helpfull builders). These engines need some back pressure! Frank (Alpha carts-where I got the built adaper and K & N filter assy) said...when running a "super trap" muffler, you need to take out some "discs" to create back pressure. Mine had 11 discs, I removed 6 and "the stumble" was very much improved! Took out 3 more discs and ran even better! I will say with every disc taken out...The exhaust "note or rumble" became "MUCH" quieter! I'm very sad about that, because with all the discs it sounded like a "Bad***" Harley! Now for the carb adjustments...If you "cut off and smooth out" the adjustment tabs you can have much more "play" with the "richening adjustments"...must say a very fine line in the adjustments and idle speed (they do affect each other). Lastly...After several removals/disassemblies and cleanings...the rubber gasket between the float bowel and carb base is not fitting (to my standards) called a Briggs small engine guy and he had 2 things to say...The gasket would only stop gas from leaking (although the gasket is formed in a way to sorround the nozzle's so I question that), then he suggested adjusting the float level. Know this really makes sence to me. I have to "crank over" the engine for at least 5 or more seconds (and most likley, use the choke) to get it to "fire up". It seems to me that the fuel is just not in the float bowel to start. There is fuel in the filter,the fuel pump starts "spitting fuel" as soon as you crank it over. His suggestion was to "adjust the float". I guess I've been working on late modle Yamaha's to long, There is no adjusting of the float and I just assumbed the same for the Briggs. Sorry for such a long post, If it helped good, If not...Please let me know what you did. Thanks Dave
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Old 12-05-2008, 10:10 PM   #25
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Default Re: 20hp Briggs "stumbles" on aceleration ?

Hey Dave,
Glad its getting better. I told you the back pressure would help. Here's a little input on the float level. Let's say its set at 1" deep. it won't matter if the engine is on or off, vacume fuel pump, electric fuel pump or gravity feed. If the fuel inlet needle is good the level will always be 1" deep. NOW if the fuel bowl has a leak the level can drop while not running. The fact that you have to crank it so much is a problem. Make sure the drain screw and fuel solenoid is tight and not dripping. I drive a big block cart to work almost year round from 25 to 105 degrees and it dosen't even have a choke hooked up. starts everytime and at the most on the coldest days rolls over twice before firing up. If I remember this engine was a good used one you had or purchased at a deal. There could be a defect in the carb, intake, or intake gaskets, intake valves and maybe thats why someone passed it on. Have you checked the valve clearance?? Make sure they have some clearance.
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Old 12-06-2008, 01:28 AM   #26
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Default Re: 20hp Briggs "stumbles" on aceleration ?

Another issue is the angle of the motor in relation to the float. Mine had issues for a while with a sticking float. the engine slant is one of the main reasons that I have thought about changing my front swingarm mount to get the motor straight
Smallblock I think we are real close in issues.

Tom
here is another thing to add. When I first got my cart running it would start no issues 2 cranks. then I had a issue with oil going into the carb with the stock air filter.
Now I have to crank it quite a bit to get it started - it acts like it has no gas in the carb.
here is the truly weird issue. Sometimes I will lift the seat and watch the motor when I start it. The fuel will come out of the fuel vent tube. then settle down and not spit out the fuel vent anymore. This may speak to a sticking fuel stop valve solenoid.
I also seem to have a vacuum leak that comes and goes. Which could also be why it has issues starting sometimes. Probably time to take it all apart and reseal it all with blue RTV and new gaskets. Mine was used with a couple hundred hours on it.
I have also thought about buying a new carb for $100
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Old 12-06-2008, 08:38 PM   #27
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Default Re: 20hp Briggs "stumbles" on aceleration ?

Shawn
Yeah it sounds like its time for a cleaning and gaskets also change the inlet needle as the oil may have affected the rubber tip on the needle. You shouldn't have fuel near the vent so the needle must not be sealing. I would avoid the silicone new gaskets will seal it fine.
Dave shouln't have a angle problem as his cart is not lifted
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Old 12-07-2008, 01:28 PM   #28
smallblock450sl
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Default Re: 20hp Briggs "stumbles" on aceleration ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by BigBlockMan View Post
Hey Dave,
Glad its getting better. I told you the back pressure would help. Here's a little input on the float level. Let's say its set at 1" deep. it won't matter if the engine is on or off, vacume fuel pump, electric fuel pump or gravity feed. If the fuel inlet needle is good the level will always be 1" deep. NOW if the fuel bowl has a leak the level can drop while not running. The fact that you have to crank it so much is a problem. Make sure the drain screw and fuel solenoid is tight and not dripping. I drive a big block cart to work almost year round from 25 to 105 degrees and it dosen't even have a choke hooked up. starts everytime and at the most on the coldest days rolls over twice before firing up. If I remember this engine was a good used one you had or purchased at a deal. There could be a defect in the carb, intake, or intake gaskets, intake valves and maybe thats why someone passed it on. Have you checked the valve clearance?? Make sure they have some clearance.
First I want to Thank You for all your help! You have never hesitated to talk to me (awnser my questions) on the phone or post here. I neglected to mention on my last post that you were instrumental in both "backpressure" and mixture adjustment ideas. Sometimes i'm to stuburn to take advise I asked for! I will look at the float level and install new gaskets. my carb doesn't leak (as far as I can see) and for some reason it doesn't have a fuel solenoid. The engine was new, never run, I beleive that. What is the correct valve clearance adjustment ? Oh well, I'll probably be calling you Monday to order a Rev kit anyway. Shawnm.....We'll get this figured out yet! Later Dave
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Old 12-07-2008, 09:42 PM   #29
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Default Re: 20hp Briggs "stumbles" on aceleration ?

the fuel solenoid is the fuel shut off solenoid on the bottom of the carb where the single wire runs. Most of the lawn mower racers remove it completely and remove the choke butterfly and shaft. I removed the fuel solenoid valve at one point, however I was having issues with the float sticking so put the solenoid back in to trouble shoot the float issue. I am thinking of taking it out in the future.

I have already cut off the idle adjustment tabs and played with mine. giving it another 1/4 turn seemed to help the idle quite a bit. You could hear it smooth out as I richened it up.

I also adjusted my valves after putting in the rev kit at .004 intake and .006 for exhaust. I never ran my motor before putting in the rev kit and advance key. So i dont know how bad the stumble was.

One thing that helped a lot more than I thought it would was switching to the NGK plugs from the Briggs Gold plugs. you could hear the sharpness in the exhaust tone. It also helped in the stumble department also.

So I am at the point where it is initially hard to start in the morning, sounds like the fuel bowl is leaking. This could be the fuel bowl gasket or the fuel solenoid gasket. I am leaning toward fuel bowl gasket because of my engine angle.
Once it has started the first time, it starts instantly after that. I dont stumble so much as just take a minute to wind up.

Tom
When I said gaskets i was meaning the carb to manifold.

shawn
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