Fully Independent Suspension Build

[DaveTM]

You can’t adjust the shocks to a softer ride? But I guess that trade off is less control at higher speeds

[Marathon Matt]

Originally Posted by DaveTM

You can’t adjust the shocks to a softer ride? But I guess that trade off is less control at higher speeds

Dave. The rear shocks are non adjustable other than preload. They’re cheap. I bought some Used Fox shocks that need to be rebuilt. They are longer as well. I’ll work on those later once I finish the brake mounting and plumbing.


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[Marathon Matt]

So, my rack and pinion modifications aren’t working out too great. So I dug around and found a steering box that should let me use stock length steering rods and position them at the same location the stock 450R’s are located. So this should give more motion to eliminate bump steer completely and tighten up the steering linkage slop that I was getting with the rack. It’s from a RZR170. I’m hoping it’s strong enough for the job. It costs less than even the cheap rack and pinions do so that’s a bonus. When it gets here next week I’ll mount it up and let y’all know how well or not well that it works.






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[Marathon Matt]

If that doesn’t work I want to try one of these electric power steering kits for RZR570-800’s. That would really sweet to have power steering even though carts really don’t need them, it would be cool to be able to steer lock to lock with one finger. But they are pricey at about $550.





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[slonomo]

Why not just use a u joint drive shaft to drive a sand rail rack, they are available in 8", 11", and 14".

Geometry is key for zero bump steer. Your inner tie rods need to bisect the line between the upper a arm mounts and lower a arm mounts. Your tie rod need to be leveled to match the angle of the upper and lower a arms. You can use heim joints for long travel with no binding, then use misalignment spacers to level the tie rod.

The heim joints, tie rods (swedge rods) and misalignment kit came from Speedway Motors.

[slonomo]

I just used the factory 4 bolt ezgo steering shaft, it has the correct 5/8 splined setup. Cut the pipe and lengthened it to reach the rack, just used steel pipe, welded it up. Worked like a dream.

[slonomo]

This is the rack I used. Can be found anywhere. "Sand Rail Rack & Pinion" I got mine from www.sandparts.com. They are designed for large VW based dune buggies so I figured it would work just fine for a golf cart buggy. Turning effort was perfect and radius was fantastic. Held up for over 9 years, sold the cart, so probably still working.

[slonomo]

For good steering and bumpsteer, the main things are this:

1. inner tie rod lines up with the upper and lower control arm bolts, basically if you draw a straight line between the upper bolt and lower bolt, the inner tie rod connection needs to fall as close to that line as possible.

2. upper a arm and lower a arm need to be perfectly parallel to each other

3. tie rod needs to match the angle of the a arms, spacers can help with this

I built my entire front suspension around these parameters. I widened the front suspension 8" so that a 14" rack unit would line up perfectly with the a arm mounts. This also gave me a shorter length tie rod, which helps with cost and leverage damage from hitting a tree stump for example, they often bend when they are really long.

I like the idea of the steering gear from the RZR170, but I'd be concerned about the mounting distance between the inner tie rod ends. Do they match up with the a arm mounts? Maybe measure the distance between the two upper a arm mounts, add that to the distance between the lower a arm mounts, then divide by two. That will give you the optimum mounting distance for the inner tie rods.

[Marathon Matt]

Thanks for those great replies Slonomo. I’ve been using those exact points and guidelines to try to get the steering to have good steering angles and reduce bump steer.

Looking back you can see how I started with an 11” rack and pinion and modified the tie rods to fit. It was too wide and wouldn’t allow me to keep to all the guidelines you mentioned.

Hindsight being 20/20 and knowing what I know now after having worked out the AArm dimensions perfectly to Honda specs, I would have made the distances between the A Arms wider like you did so that a rack and pinion would have worked the way yours does. However it would have made the front far to wide in comparison to the rear track width. The Honda 450r arms are pretty wide, especially with the wheel adapters for going from 4/144 to 4/4” pattern for golf cart wheels.

My second attempt to resolve this was by cutting down the rack as far as possible to narrow it up and get the pivot points to line up like you show. Unfortunately that caused a reduction in steering angle to a point that was unacceptable (because even with the shorter rack I still had to pull the rack and pinion backwards toward the rear of the cart to get the ball joint pivot point at the rack to be in plane with the a arms pivot points.)

What I have is pretty much exact copy of the 450R front end now. And it uses a steering stem with side by side inner tie rod mounting holes like what you see on that RZR170 steering box. So I’m hoping that this RZR box along with stock length 450r tie rods is going to get me to where I want to be, which is good steering angle with little to no bumpsteer without me having to rebuild the subframe for the arms to be wider while also requiring me to go to a 4/144 bolt pattern wheel to keep the track widths close to that of the rear end. I really don’t want the front to be a lot wider than the rear, I think it just looks weird on a cart.

Thanks again for all your input and pictures. I’m sure it will help anyone who might read this thread before attempting to put ATV front suspension on their carts. [emoji106]

[slonomo]

Well, between your project and mine I think we got the atv front suspension bugs worked out

I must've missed the part of your thread where you used the 11" rack and pinion, I'll have to revisit. Also I didn't know what the spacing was on the steering connection for the inner tie rods, didn't realize it was so narrow. I guess now that I think about atv's they do have that little triangle plate attached to the steering shaft, that is pretty narrow.

Hopefully the setup you're going with gets it done. I know how frustrating it is to be this close and it's not quite where you want it. I think you'll get it. It just takes trial and error and dolla billz