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Old 09-20-2021, 12:25 PM   #1
SouthernFlyed
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Default Motor & Contoller or just Controller

1997 EZGO 36v TXT DCS cart upgrading question?

New LIPO4 drop in batteries (3 12vs and 4ga wiring and volt meter) due to ship this Friday. 100AH, 200AH 3/5 mins, 300AH for 5 seconds (conversation with manufactuer and batteries may go as high as 350ah before turning off).

400amp Alltrax Controller shows improved speed and torque from stock EZGO motors (may rebuild), but thinking about upgrade to Admiral B2 (stronger than stock motor), both will work on the 36v set up. 4" lift and 20" wheels go on this week

With the batteries BMS set to turn off at a bit over 300amps, is having a 400amp controller a smart move??? Will the 400 amp controller help with speed and torque at the 100AH and 200AH? Can the Alltrax400 be set to shut down at 300/350? Controller and new motor, or controller and rebuild stock motor?

Sporting clays & granddaughter limo cart with no need for much over high teens, but do need the torque to help with moderate hills here in North Carolina.

Thanks!!!
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Old 09-20-2021, 04:51 PM   #2
bronsonj
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Default Re: Motor & Contoller or just Controller

Hi Southern,

On your cart with the aftermarket controller and stock motor on lithium batteries you will be amazed at the performance difference. You will gain both speed and torque. Your maximum amp draw will be from a dead stop. For example if you were stopped on a hill facing up and mashed the throttle you might see a half second of amps up near 350 or higher. As the motor spins faster it is simply not capable of drawing as many amps, so once you get moving you'll see the amps drop and after a second you'll be under 300. After several seconds you'll be down to 150 or so.

Having said that, I don't think your battery will complain about a momentary 400 amp draw. If you are worried about it, you can adjust it in the Alltrax Toolkit (free download) to set the max battery amps to 350. You will need to be in there anyway to make sure you set the voltage cutoffs (low and high) to where you want them.

Amps is what gives you torque and *I think* your stock controller was 235 amps, so 350 or 400 amps will be a big improvement.

Set your RPM limit in the Alltrax Toolkit too. 6,000 is generally considered safe. If your new tires are 20.5 inch high pressure tires (don't get ATV/riding lawnmower tires) then you should be able to get in the 28/29 mph range. That might be a bit much and you may want to set that limit lower, depends on how your cart handles and who you expect to be driving it.

If you have a mechanical issue like dragging brakes, bad alignment, low pressure tires, etc then your top speed will be less.

You do want to be mindful of your top speed when coasting... Your NC hills might get you scooting past what's safe for your motor RPM. It's spinning even if your foot is off of the throttle. 30mph is vaguely 6,000 rpm, if you go much past that the motor can come apart and destroy itself and likely your new controller while also locking the rear wheels so you'll be sliding... That'd make for a bad day!!!

So drop in the lithium, replace the controller, update your settings and have a go at it. You will likely never need to replace the motor, so long as your current motor is working. When your current motor starts giving you issues have it cleaned out and new brushes put in and it'll probably be just fine for another 20 years
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Old 09-20-2021, 04:56 PM   #3
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Default Re: Motor & Contoller or just Controller

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Originally Posted by bronsonj View Post
You do want to be mindful of your top speed when coasting... Your NC hills might get you scooting past what's safe for your motor RPM. It's spinning even if your foot is off of the throttle. 30mph is vaguely 6,000 rpm, if you go much past that the motor can come apart and destroy itself and likely your new controller while also locking the rear wheels so you'll be sliding... That'd make for a bad day!!!
I don't want you to think that 6,001 rpm will destroy your motor... But the long life rule of thumb is 6k rpm or less. But if 30mph is your limit you really don't want to be scooting along at 35mph (6,900 rpm roughly)
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Old 09-20-2021, 06:05 PM   #4
SouthernFlyed
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Default Re: Motor & Contoller or just Controller

Thanks bronsonj!

Everything ordered and shipping this week with one slight change. The controller will now be a Navitas 600amp with "on the fly" adjustments that my buddy found at a very good price. He's doing the rebuild with very minimal help from me (he's seen my mechanical expertise and still laughing his arse off).

The 600amp was what we could find to get the B2 motor, both are in short supply (as are 400 & 500amp controllers), and like the shotgun shells I shoot clays with, ain't nothing getting any cheaper! We'll see soon, October thru the rest of the year will tell the tale for sure.

Folks have assured me the 600amp maybe overkill, but with all the settings on em nowadays, it'll be like a SpaceX launch and re-entry for me.

Thanks again!
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Old 09-24-2021, 12:09 PM   #5
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Default Re: Motor & Contoller or just Controller

SouthernFlyed,

I just did an upgrade on a 1997 TXT DCS 36v. Navitas 600amp, Plum Quick Bandit, HD solenoid. I'm very happy with the performance now but it was a major struggle to get to this point. I now get 25-26 MPH with great torque.

When I put the Navitas in I had a lot of trouble and had to send it back twice. Was told the first time that it was fine from the distributor and it was faulty when I sent to Navitas the second time. I spent several months going through trouble shooting with Navitas before getting it back the final time with a replacement controller. Once it was working I actually lost 2 MPH over the stock Curtis 1206SX controller. Contacted Navitas again and was told that they would give me access to the engineering tabs in the App and I could make a configuration setting change but it would lock out the OTF adjustments. In addition due to this type of cart having no speed sensor you cannot read your speed or RPM's on the app. I was told that their engineers are working on a "Fix" so that I could use the OTF eventually but when I asked how I could get on a notification list of when the "fix" was developed I was ignored.

Hopefully your experience will be much better. I will help you where I can. I do know my cart much better now though!
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Old 09-24-2021, 03:20 PM   #6
SouthernFlyed
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Default Re: Motor & Contoller or just Controller

BluChez1 ---- I'd be absolutely delighted to get 22/23 and that 'plenty of torque" staying with the 36v lithium drop ins! It was so difficult to go piece by piece, ordered a controller/motor package w/solenoid and 2ga wires.

Everything should be here by first of the week, and again anything over high teens with the B2 motor & 600amp Navitas controller.

How long ago did you add the Navitas controller?

Thanks!!!
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Old 09-30-2021, 12:15 PM   #7
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Default Re: Motor & Contoller or just Controller

I started my project at the end of March and didn't get her operational until July. There was at least a month or more of down time having to send the controller back 2X. I've asked Navitas for an update on their "Fix" and was ignored once again.
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Old 09-30-2021, 01:23 PM   #8
SouthernFlyed
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Default Re: Motor & Contoller or just Controller

Quote:
Originally Posted by BlueChez1 View Post
I started my project at the end of March and didn't get her operational until July. There was at least a month or more of down time having to send the controller back 2X. I've asked Navitas for an update on their "Fix" and was ignored once again.
Sorry to hear about your controller!

All my stuff is laid out as of noon today, tied up this weekend thru Monday, but hopefully will have some idea of whether "this dog will hunt" end of next week. Drop ins came with 4ga, everything else is gonna be 2ga (might just do it all with 2ga).

Not sure I'll get PlumQuick speed out of the B2, but the torque should be right good.

Any issues with the "regen", and I know that depends on the controller, but thats the one thing I can't seem to wrap my head around???

Good Luck & Thanks!!!
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Old 10-02-2021, 07:53 PM   #9
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Default Re: Motor & Contoller or just Controller

Southern, if you get your regen tuned right it'll make you love your ride. Basically regen is when you let off the accelerator pedal and the motor turns into a generator slowing your cart and charging your pack.

I have mine set to 94 amps of regen and it slows my light lithium cart wonderfully. The shunt current I have set to half that. So the regen will charge my batteries when it can up to 94 amps, but as the motor/generator slows down it produces less voltage and eventually gets to a point where it can't charge the pack so it shunts the current (basically shorts out the current) up to the amps you specify. So that's just slowing your cart and wasting energy like brakes, so I turned that down a bit.

Your cart is completely different than mine so you will want to tweak your settings to get what you want. But regen is a good thing and if you spend an hour playing with your settings it'll really help the drive and feel of your cart.
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Old 10-03-2021, 08:12 AM   #10
SouthernFlyed
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Default Re: Motor & Contoller or just Controller

Quote:
Originally Posted by bronsonj View Post
Southern, if you get your regen tuned right it'll make you love your ride. Basically regen is when you let off the accelerator pedal and the motor turns into a generator slowing your cart and charging your pack.

I have mine set to 94 amps of regen and it slows my light lithium cart wonderfully. The shunt current I have set to half that. So the regen will charge my batteries when it can up to 94 amps, but as the motor/generator slows down it produces less voltage and eventually gets to a point where it can't charge the pack so it shunts the current (basically shorts out the current) up to the amps you specify. So that's just slowing your cart and wasting energy like brakes, so I turned that down a bit.

Your cart is completely different than mine so you will want to tweak your settings to get what you want. But regen is a good thing and if you spend an hour playing with your settings it'll really help the drive and feel of your cart.
Thanks! How far off the "black line" mark on the OTF recommended setting did you go?
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