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Old 08-12-2021, 10:11 AM   #41
PingEye3
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Default Re: RoyPow problems

Quote:
Originally Posted by sailfishgolfer View Post
To all who have replied regarding the AFCI Breaker.

First, the national electric code will be making these required. Already many local jurisdictions have (mine for example). These breaker are not only expensive, they are a real PIA! I have no doubt I'll be taking it out and installing a standard 20 Amp Breaker ($7 vs $50)

Why do I have an AFCI breaker?

The AFCI Breaker had to be installed as the outlet for my cart location was a new outlet. I live in a condo / homeowner association. So the new outlet had to be permitted and inspected. By the way the outlet is also a GFCI. The AFCI breaker have indicator trip lights that you can see what causes the trip; An arc or GFI: here's 2 links to show you what I have:

https://www.downloads.siemens.com/do...id1=BTLV_40705

https://new.siemens.com/us/en/produc...-breakers.html

On the 2nd link scroll down to select "1 pole breaker"


But, that does not mean that there is not an issue with the ROYPOW design.

To test the breaker I ran 5 different items: 2 fans, 1 drill, 1 radio and for fun a 1200 Watt iron, simultaneously. Breaker did not trip. I thought it might, with fans and drill on hi, when the iron, with its additional amp drawn might make it trip. It did not.

The breaker ONLY trips when the charger starts.

And it only trips the "arc" error indicator lights. So, it's either the charger design, or the charger and powercell combination that produces a milliamp arc, thus tripping the breaker.

I am working with a ROYPOW support person in Southern California. His english is very good....his electrical knowledge - not so much.

So he is learning about AFCI for the first time. I'll try to update this thread as things change. I've asked ROYPOW to send or supply me a second charger to see if I just have a faulty one. If that is all it is then all is good. So I am waiting on their response.

If you electric gurus have any input on the AFCI breakers and would like to chime in - I'm all ears.

So ...it is definitely an "ARC" that is tripping the breaker (it is NOT the GFIC) "side' of the circuit. Only one "appliance" (the ROYPOW charger) trips it. So the breaker is good and functioning properly.

Thanks for the input!
Just curious, was the charger already plugged into AC and then, when charger is plugged into cart this AFCI tripped? Or, did it trip only when first plugged into AC outlet. If when first plugging into AC, I suspect that the caps charging in the charger are causing the AFCI to trip on arc because of powering up the caps. If that is when it happens, can you immediately reset the AFCI without unplugging and get the charger to work?

The Chinese chargers I use on my Leaf packs always had an arc when plugging into AC. I didn't have your problem because just I'm on just a 25 yr old GFI breaker. I suspect I would have similar issues using the Chinese charger with AFCI breaker.

Also, what Walter mentioned about surge protector. It may keep the AFCI from seeing the arc. Worth a try.
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Old 09-14-2021, 07:29 PM   #42
Mobilekaraoke
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Default Re: RoyPow problems

I just got the s51160 and can confirm it trips the afci breaker in my new house. Had to move it to a plain gcfi circuit.
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Old 02-07-2022, 09:59 PM   #43
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Default Re: RoyPow problems

My new 551105P with roypow charger pops my gfci outlets. Two 20 amp outlets and one 15 amp outlet. Rewired a 20 amp no gfi outlet and it charges fine.

The issue from the previous posts was for AFCI outlets so don’t think same issue as mine. Any thoughts on why mine is behaving like this? I would rather not use a non gfi outlet in my garage as I’ve got four kids.
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Old 02-07-2022, 10:06 PM   #44
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Default Re: RoyPow problems

Not good. That means that there is leakage to ground not going through the neutral. Could be a capacitor that should not be there. I would contact them and get it fixed. Running without a GFI in the garage isn't safe as you said and no device should do this unless it's defective.
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Old 02-08-2022, 08:55 AM   #45
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Default Re: RoyPow problems

Just an aside and may not pertain here: We are required to use GFCI breakers on our swimming pool pumps (newer code). The most common breakers (Square D) here trip every time, but the Siemens breakers will hold (they are more expensive and harder to find). It has been explained to me that there is a "trip load" attached to the breakers, and some (Square D in this case) have a lower trip load which causes this to occur.

You might check the breakers you have and see if you can find the trip value. Replacing them with a more "robust" breaker may solve your problem.
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Old 02-08-2022, 08:59 AM   #46
Volt_Ampere
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Default Re: RoyPow problems

I can see this with a pump - the starting current is much higher than the running current - unless it's one of the newer speed regulated motors. With a charger, you have some caps to charge but it should not trip a GFI. My Tesla charger and all of my golf cart chargers work fine on my garage 15 amp GFI.
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Old 02-08-2022, 10:00 PM   #47
sgrol
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Default Re: RoyPow problems

These meters are great for monitoring the battery. Cheap and easy to use and set up. I use them on my RV (one for gen battery and one for RV) and one on the golf cart after lithium upgrade.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/323912880538 Amazon carries them too.
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Old 02-09-2022, 01:27 PM   #48
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Default Re: RoyPow problems

To clarify, the GFI outlet trips, not the actual circuit breaker. Once I switched to non gfi outlet all charges fine.

I don't know if there is a capacitor somewhere in the system. Not sure why there would be one in the charger.

Also not sure if possibly the charger uses PWM outputs. I've read that this noise is interpreted by a GFI as a ground fault.

I called the dealership and talked to their wiring guy. He said they have this issue all the time and not just with roypow chargers. He said the manufacturers recommend not using gfi outlet. What he couldn't tell me is the why behind what's happening. Said maybe on initial start up it's momentarily spiking past 20 amps. I don't quite buy that as it would pop the breaker not the fault interrupt.

Something is leaking current to the ground instead of back to neutral. Or maybe there is some noise that's being interpreted as such. All seems to charge fine, not get warm and not pop the actual breaker.

Unless someone has a better solution think I'm going to buy one of those child protective covers to go over the outlet and just move on with life.
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Old 02-09-2022, 07:22 PM   #49
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Default Re: RoyPow problems

Quote:
Originally Posted by Volt_Ampere View Post
I can see this with a pump - the starting current is much higher than the running current - unless it's one of the newer speed regulated motors. With a charger, you have some caps to charge but it should not trip a GFI. My Tesla charger and all of my golf cart chargers work fine on my garage 15 amp GFI.
I agree if the start up load was initiated at the start, as you said (and I should have clarified that!). In this case these are all VS (Variable Speed) pumps with a "soft start" ramp up, so the load is low initially. Just weird (and like I said, may not apply!) so thought I would throw it out there :)
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Old 02-09-2022, 08:38 PM   #50
Volt_Ampere
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Default Re: RoyPow problems

Something is leaking to ground that should not be if it's tripping the GFI. This should not be happening and if they say it's normal, that is BS. These things should be UL approved but I bet that many of the chargers from China are not.
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