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Old 01-16-2021, 11:39 AM   #1
slonomo
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Default G1 Predator 670 Vtwin

The 16hp Vanguard in my G1 is obviously tired and needs a rebuild. But, when I calculated out the cost of machining, pistons, rings, gaskets, etc, I came up with over $400 cost. As I contemplated this, I asked myself, "why would I spend $400 on a stock rebuild?" That's the thing.....I wouldn't. If I invest time and machining into the 16 Vanguard, I would build it up a bit better.

So.....the decision has been made.... to install a brand new engine, the Harbor Freight Predator 670 Vtwin.....

I obtained a coupon for $659.99 plus tax and delivery to my door = $727.96

The plan is just to keep the engine stock, with the governor intact, and use the cart in the yard. This will also serve as an opportunity to test and review and compare the 670 to the 16hp Vanguard, as well as the 23hp Vanguard I recently removed.

I know, it sounds crazy right? This guy had a 23hp Vanguard, modified it, sold it, installed a worn out 16hp Vanguard....and now a 670? Well, yes. If you want to know what the ultimate powerplant for a built off road cart is....you have to try them all!
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Old 01-16-2021, 05:46 PM   #2
ProjectClubCar
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Default Re: G1 Predator 670 Vtwin

Welcome to the 670 Club!!!
I know you have a few different engines that you have tried, you will be able to form your own opinion of what you like and what you don't like, you'll also be able to decide what is good and what is bad. My question is how many Vegas carts engines have you had? I asked a question because I have never owned one so I can't compare the 670 to the Vegas, only to the
Vanguards. As much as I like the 670, it by no means compares to Vanguard 23 in any manner.Size, power, torque all fall short to the 23.

What I do like about the 670, it is quiet, all the things that are missing from the Vanguard, make the 670 a smoother running engine, from off idle to wide open the transition is quite smooth, the same can be said about cruising around half throttle into going from half throttle to wide open that transition is very smooth as well, it took a little bit to get the two barrel carburetor that came with it dialed in I had to pick those little metal tabs out, to be able to just each cylinder accordingly, after I did that the engine quit stumbling.
I know you won't be able to run my throttle set up, cuz you are going to the governor.
Now that I said a few good things and things that I like about the 670, it by no means, has the jump or response that you get with the Vanguard.
The beautiful thing about this is you will be able to form your own opinions.......... not just hearsay from somebody that really doesn't know what they're talking about!!!!!

(O wait thats me i am talking about)


Shout out to Shep, thanks for having the patience to help me with the 2 barrels.....
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Old 01-16-2021, 06:11 PM   #3
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Default Re: G1 Predator 670 Vtwin

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Originally Posted by ProjectClubCar View Post
Welcome to the 670 Club!!!
I know you have a few different engines that you have tried, you will be able to form your own opinion of what you like and what you don't like, you'll also be able to decide what is good and what is bad. My question is how many Vegas carts engines have you had? I asked a question because I have never owned one so I can't compare the 670 to the Vegas, only to the
Vanguards. As much as I like the 670, it by no means compares to Vanguard 23 in any manner.Size, power, torque all fall short to the 23.
PCC, you are the only one I know on the forum that has had both a 23 Vanguard and a Predator 670 (in the same cart), so your opinion actually convinced me to try it. The funny thing about it is that I got rid of the 23 Vanguard because it had "too much power" Well, my wife and kids couldn't drive it comfortably, and I don't like a cart that doesn't get driven. So in my case, a milder powerplant was preferred. So....670 was next up.

One thing to consider here, I'm betting your cart is much lighter than mine. I bet mine weighs close to 1000 lbs wet. Might even be over. With all 260 lbs of me on there.....ooof that's alot of weight.

The Vegas Carts engine was a fun project and it earned my respect. It was by far the best powerplant to propel me to 40mph (and beyond) that I've ever had. Now, the 23 would smoke it from 0-34.5! But I never took the 23 past 5000 rpm at 35 mph, so it was not the "fastest" but it was the "quickest".

The biggest difference I saw from the built VC460 to the 16 Vanguard was low end torque. The acceleration was very similar though, just take felt more powerful on the Vtwin, very noticable.

Comparing the VC460 to the 23? No....not even in the same ballpark! The 23 is worlds above. We shall see what the 670 feels like.

As far as what engines I've had.....here's the list

1. Stock Yamaha 215 2 stroke (new crank, piston, rings, bearings)
2. Enticer 250 (top end kit with head and Bravo carb)
3. Vegas Carts 440 (stock)
4. Vegas Carts 440 (rev kit and Isky race cam, 28mm slide carb)
5. Vegas Carts 460 (billet rod, new crank and cylinder)
6. Vanguard 16hp (stock)
7. Vanguard 16hp (rev kit)
8. Vanguard 23hp (stock)
9. Vanguard 23hp (42mm and 34mm Mikuni carbs)
10. Vanguard 16hp (rev kit and cam)
11. Soon....Predator 670....
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Old 01-18-2021, 05:47 PM   #4
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Talking Re: G1 Predator 670 Vtwin

So do you have the old motor out yet? Where do you stand on the G1?
(No where stand, just a seat to sit on)
Do you actually lift the motor out, using arm strength, or do you remove it using some kind of lift or hoist?

I rigged up a portable winch, and hung it from the header of the garage door. I was tearing my hands up trying to drop it in using arm strength. I had to come up with something......
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Old 01-18-2021, 06:55 PM   #5
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Default Re: G1 Predator 670 Vtwin

Ha ha. Yes, on the G1 the engine is still in it. It takes me 15 minutes to yank it. All arm and back strength. Just tighten the core, squeeze my butt cheeks together, and lift. Of course, I was once a power lifter so.... I do have an engine hoist for the big ones. The 23 Vanguard? Yep, used the lift. I'll prob use the lift to set the 670 in there.
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Old 01-18-2021, 07:16 PM   #6
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Default Re: G1 Predator 670 Vtwin

The 670 weighs a lot more than the Vanguard, done it?
It's also bulkier than the Vanguard, when you start the build take lots of pictures, I love pictures.....
breaking out the Crayolas as we speak......
Get to it brother!!!!
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Old 01-18-2021, 07:19 PM   #7
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Default Re: G1 Predator 670 Vtwin

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Originally Posted by ProjectClubCar View Post
The 670 weighs a lot more than the Vanguard, done it?
It's also bulkier than the Vanguard, when you start the build take lots of pictures, I love pictures.....
breaking out the Crayolas as we speak......
Get to it brother!!!!
Thanks man. I'll update this thread as I go. The engine isn't here yet. No eta at the moment.

Andy
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Old 01-19-2021, 09:56 PM   #8
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Default Re: G1 Predator 670 Vtwin

You should have kept the 23hp just my 2 cents
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Old 01-19-2021, 10:04 PM   #9
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Default Re: G1 Predator 670 Vtwin

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You should have kept the 23hp just my 2 cents
Bought it for $900, used it, had some fun, sold it for $1100. I went the wrong direction with it honestly. It was just too much engine and performance for what I needed. (never thought I'd say that) I hadn't planned on rebuilding the 16 yet so that was a bummer, really like that engine, it was perfect. But, with the coupon the 670 makes sense, plus I like to test out new options. Using the 670 in stock form will buy me some time to rebuild the 16 and still allow me to use my cart all year. When it's all said and done, I'll be able to make a decision on which engine I'll use permanently.
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Old 01-19-2021, 10:14 PM   #10
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Default Re: G1 Predator 670 Vtwin

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Originally Posted by slonomo View Post
...When it's all said and done, I'll be able to make a decision on which engine I'll use permanently.
Who are you kiddin? As many engines have been in that thing, nothing is gonna be "Permanent" from here...just a temporary resident in the engine bay till the next new thing comes along. LOL
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