Motor options

[orangeman6]

So, if anyone saw my previous thread on intermittent power, I'm now in the market for a new motor.

http://www.buggiesgonewild.com/elect...-intermittent-
power.html

Current setup:
2001 txt freedom
sr48500 with fn switch
2g cables
Nissan leaf pack at 58.2v
super duty contactor
400 amp solenoid
30-32 mph on the flats with one rider
no backseat
stock height on 20" tires
stock gears

I checked with Scottyb, but he doesn't have a motor that he thinks will suit my needs. I had heard great things about PQ and EMP, so I emailed both of them detailed info on what Ive got and what Im after. I think both places are extremely busy, and seem to be family run businesses, so communications have taken some time. PQ did finally suggest an option, but there weren't really any details provided. Im not knocking them, I just needed to know what all they were planning to do, as far as the build, with the suggested motor. On the other hand, Chuck at EMP sent an incredibly detailed email that outlined numerous options, asked for some additional info, and took the time to explain why certain things were suggested. It is very obvious that he strives to get the customer exactly what they need.

The only piece of info Chuck is still asking for is a voltage profile on my lithium pack. Basically, he wants to know what voltages I'm seeing while cruising down the road with a fully charged pack. I look at my in dash meter, but I cant really recall what the numbers would be. He suggested I log a data file from the Alltrax. I haven't done that before, and figure it would be good to know how to do it, so I'm going to put the old motor in and do that tomorrow.

I've hacked up Chuck's email quite a bit and pasted the rest below for input. I know its long, but I also know there are guys here that are very familiar with all of this, and may have some input, along with some guys that will be interested in learning some stuff about upgraded motors. I would welcome any advice but am planning on choosing whatever option I figure is the most robust. I'd rather not spend a fortune, but I also don't want to cheap out on a few $ either.

NOTE: I decided to go back and delete all of the pricing info Chuck provided. He probably doesn't care, but I havent checked with him and its not on his website. If anyone is curious, Id be happy to let them know any of the pricing info via pm.

VEHICLE INFORMATION
EZGO (’01 TXT), series, 2 passenger (possible backseat in future), “58.2”
volts (converted from 36v), Alltrax 48500 control, CD6-4001 motor (or
equivalent), roof, windshield, stock gears

APPLICATION INFO and PERFORMANCE TARGETS
Originally did 21-23 MPH on 36V with 20” tires. Got about 30-32 MPH after
change to Li-ion battery pack, which is the new target speed.
Maximum loading of 400 pounds.
Topographical review of terrain in your area shows off road grades as steep
as 60% off road and generally less than 10% grade on road. (This is within ½
mile of provided address.)
Possible interest in 2-speed design.

REQUIRED INFORMATION
- Voltage profile of customer's Li-ion battery pack.
SPEED- WE WILL TARGET 30-32 MPH
ACTUAL VOLTAGE
What I really need to know is what voltage the battery pack produces while going down the road. So, my question is about what “58.2” volts means. Is this the voltage of a
charged battery pack at rest? Or is this the actual voltage the pack
delivers when you are actually driving full speed down the road.

OPTIONAL MOTOR FEATURES:

HIGH SPEED BANDING
We normally recommend high speed banding when an application will result in
motor RPM exceeding 6000 RPM. For your application as described (20” tires,
stock gears) this occurs at about 28.6 MPH. Since your target top speed is
30-32 MPH, this is STRONGLY RECOMMENDED for your application. When we do add high speed banding, we add banding groove(s) in armature core, install
banding in grooves and at ends of armature stack, cure, and apply epoxy
varnish.

THERMOSTAT
We can install a N.O. (Normally Open) thermostat in the motor brush mech. This can be used to power a light, buzzer, beeper, etc to warn of
possible motor overheat.

HEAVY DUTY BRUSH MECHANISM
These designs are generally made out of materials that can withstand higher
temperatures which can often occur in tougher applications.

WHAT SPEED SHOULD YOU BE GETTING RIGHT NOW?
The data you provided about the motor was very useful. The stack, #arm
slots, #field turns, etc have confirmed that this motor is either model
CD6-4001 (one of the motors that Santiago bought from Advanced DC) or
something functionally equivalent.
Just as a sanity check, I calculated what I thought you should be getting
for top speed. If you had a conventional 48V battery pack, my calculations
say you would have achieved about exactly 30 MPH. If your Li-ion pack give
a few more volts, that probably explains your top speed.

Also, just for reference, just to maintain a top speed of 30 MPH on a 48V
pack on hard flat level ground would require amps of about 109 amps.
Accelerating, climbing hills, or adding load to the vehicle will increase
amp levels. (Also, when this was only 36V, going 22 MPH probably required
about 80 amps or so.)

2-SPEED SYSTEMS
2-speed systems are best for people who have 2 distinctly different modes of
driving. For example, people who use their golf cars for hunting will often
buy 2-speed motors from EMP. They would operate in TORQUE mode when off
road, climbing around on hills and trails, carrying heavier loads, when top
speed is not the main concern. Then, when they got back on harder flatter
more level surfaces, they could change to SPEED mode and pick up several
miles per hour of top speed as well.

Now, if you are not sure whether you want a 2-speed system or not, I often
encourage people to get the motor as 2-speed anyways. Why?
- EMP doesn't charge any more to make the motor 2-speed.**
- EMP would provide jumpers so you could try out each mode and you could leave these permanently connected if you want.
- You can order (or not) the switch kit anytime if you choose.
- You get "2 motors in one" so you have some flexibility.
(** The switch kit does cost extra if you want to switch "on the fly". Some
people choose to use a paired contactor to switch between modes instead of
the big mechanical switch. We don't sell them, but I can provide guidance
on how to wire and where to buy.)

MOTOR OPTIONS
In the end, there will be several different motors that can meet your
performance needs. Some of them are going to be tougher than others, some
might be faster climbing grades, etc.

OPTION 1 - upgraded version of present motor - CD6-4001-LR
This option would really be quite close to your present motor. EMP would,
however, install an alternate field winding with lower resistance, reducing
field losses. Also, as mentioned earlier, we would also install low loss
brushes as well.

RETAIL PRICING:
- Base Price
- core charge
– OPTIONAL - heavy duty brush mechanism
- OPTIONAL - thermostat
- STRONGLY RECOMMENDED - HIGH SPEED BANDING
- LR5.x switch kit - optional and only for 2-spd motors
- 44 pound motor / 5 pound switch kit


OPTION 2 - upgraded D&D motor - 170-006-0001-LR
This option is similar to your present motor, but has a slightly longer
stack and also has brushes with 1.25x the cross section as your present
motor (or option 1). The brush mechanism also comes standard as the heavy
duty type.
This design will be slightly tougher thermally that the option 1 design and
would also produce slightly higher ultimate torque as well.

RETAIL PRICING:
- Base Price
- core charge
- STANDARD - heavy duty brush mechanism
- OPTIONAL - thermostat
- STRONGLY RECOMMENDED - HIGH SPEED BANDING
- LR5.x switch kit - optional and only for 2-spd motors
+ s/h - 48 pound motor / 5 pound switch kit


OPTION 3 - upgraded Advanced motor - ZQS48-3.8-Tb-LR
This option has some of the features of both of the earlier options. It was
originally made by Advanced DC. EMP replaces the armature with the same bar
count as in the option 1 design. The brush mechanism comes standard as the
heavy duty type and the brush cross section is 1.25 times that found in the
option 1 motor. The stack is longer than any of the other designs as well.
In the end, these features make this the toughest of all of the options
presented so far.

RETAIL PRICING:
- Base Price
- core charge
- STANDARD - heavy duty brush mechanism
- OPTIONAL - thermostat
- RECOMMENDED - HIGH SPEED BANDING
- LR5.x switch kit - optional and only for 2-spd motors
+ s/h - 56 pound motor / 5 pound switch kit

OPTION 4 - upgraded GE forklift motor - 5BC48JB3047-LR
This option is a converted forklift traction motor. It is similar to option
1 as it has a low armature bar count with large conductors. The brush cross
section, however, is even larger and is 50% larger in cross section as
compared to that found in the option 1 motor. The brush mechanism comes
standard as the heavy duty type and is the reaction type, which is less
prone to stuck brush issues.

This motor would actually have similar performance to the option 1 design,
but would be considerably tougher thermally due to larger brush and
conductor sizes.

RETAIL PRICING:
–- Base Price
–- core charge
-- STANDARD - heavy duty brush mechanism
-- OPTIONAL - thermostat (N.O. or N.C)
-- STRONGLY RECOMMENDED - High speed banding
+ s/h -- 48 pound motor

SLIGHTLY LONGER LEAD TIME FOR THIS MOTOR TYPE DUE TO CUSTOM MACHINING, BUT
PRESENTLY 20 CORES OF THIS TYPE AVAILABLE.