Gas Club Car Carryall I Engine Swap

[jscola]

Hello,

This is my first post on this website, so I hope I chose the right area to post a new thread. This is not exactly a big block engine swap, but more or just a larger engine swap.

Background:
I recently purchased a 1998 Club Car Carryall I. It is in great running condition, with no issues other than a few exterior cosmetic dents and scratches. I attached two images of the cart for context. My goal here is to swap out the current FE 290 and place in the DuroMax XP18HP 440cc.

I do have a degree in electrical engineering, but I have little to no mechanical experience or shop work, so when it comes to swapping the engine itself, I really do not know where to start. With ignoring practicality of use and obvious safety factors (for now), my goal is to get this Carryall up to at least 40MPH.

What I do know:
-The DuroMax XP18HP 440cc rotates CCW, while the 1998 build of the FE 290 rotates CW. I did read on one of the threads here that the way the CW transmission for Club Car models built in this era will not be destroyed with the CCW engine, with the only "issue" I will have being the physical shifter itself will have opposite labeling (which does not matter to me).
-With the CCW engine being swapped, I know that I will have to swap the starter/generator from a CW to CCW model. I have already found a replacement for this, and this is not something I am too concerned about.

I did see on YouTube someone swap a 1990 Club Car DS FE 290 engine with the engine I listed, however the person in this video has clearly had lots of shop experience, as he built/welded custom mounts and extensions for everything. I am not at the skill level to do this, so I am hoping there is a more straightforward approach.

What I am writing this thread is to ask: Is there anything in particular I should look into for this swap? Is there anything that will give me more trouble than anything else? Are there any conversion kits that already exist for this engine?

Any sort of guidance will help, thank you!

[slonomo]

Most aftermarket engines run CCW. If your cart came with the CW rotation engine, your issue is that you will be running the transmission backwards, essentially using reverse gear to move the cart forward. This will make the cart very slow on the top speed since reverse gear is a much lower gear. Lots of people do this, but they will change out the gears in the transaxle to an 8:1 set or even 6:1 set, this will gain the speed back to around 20-25 mph.

Most of us that do big block swaps are using carts that have transaxles that have the CCW rotation, the same as the big block engines CCW rotation. This gives us more power with the same amount of gear ratio/top speed. Most of these engines with more power don't make the top speed higher, you just get there quicker. To get more top speed you need to increase the final drive ratio by using taller gears in the transaxle and/or using larger rear tires.

As far as the engine swap itself. I don't think there is a kit for that cart, just not common enough. Doesn't mean a kit for a different model Club Car won't work, but you'd just have to do more research.

Most of us that do big block swaps need the following:
1. engine with ccw rotation and 1" straight shaft crank
2. drive clutch for 1" crankshaft
3. stock driven clutch with stock spring
4. HD kevlar ribbed style belt, length will vary
5. starter/gen that spins CCW
6. engine mounting plate, usually custom ordered or fabricated
7. starter/gen mount, usually fabricated
8. option to make the engine start like a car with key switch

If you do not have any mechanical experience or skills, this job will be a learning experience to say the least, and not for the faint of heart. It will cost you 2x to 3x what you think it will cost, unless you are really good at doing things on the cheap and using parts you already have. Most kits, if you find one that will work, will cost $1000-$3000 depending on how complete the kit is, and if it comes with an engine or not. Many of us have done big block swaps for less than $500, which is tough to do, and requires lots of spare parts we already had, tools we already had, and mechanical skills we already had. It's not easy, although some people make it look so.

[slonomo]

Here's a thread that might have some helpful info:

https://www.buggiesgonewild.com/showthread.php?t=172255

[raydhd]

Club Cars are a tough decision for a swap.IF it were me in this spot I would look into using a modded Vegascarts HF 670 kit. It drives a flywheel mounted clutch adapter that solves the rotation issue. How much modification is needed from the made for another Club Car kit I cannot say. MAYBE Vegascarts can advice if others have done this model. P.S. There are a ton of Club Car conversion kits out there and the users seem to really be happy with the outcome.

[raydhd]

I did read your OP in more detail. 40 mph in your cart is going to be extra difficult due to it's gearing. It is geared for power rather than speed.On top of that unless you go a PTO type conversion the reverse usage to go forward is geared even lower. I think a high speed gear conversion is going to have to be done along with an ungoverned engine. Also some much bigger diameter tires will help. For a non mechanic it is going to be a tall order.

[jscola]

Upon doing some more research, and seeing the sets of replies between this thread and the other one I created, I plan on going now with the Predator 15.8 HP (459cc) Max Performance engine, as opposed to the DuroMax engine I previously listed. With this being said, I plan on getting the "Vegas Predator 459cc Install Kit for 1984 - 1996 Club Car DS" conversion kit, to make my life a lot easier, as opposed to attempting to fabricate and custom build all parts, especially given my minimal mechanical experience. In addition, I plan on swapping the current gearing ratio to a 8:1 to allow for more speed with the new direction, and still have some backend power.

I do have a few new questions now:
-Based on my reading, it seems as if the Club Car DS has a very similar (if not exact) base frame as the Club Car Carryall I and II. Is my assumption correct?
-I did notice that the Vegas conversion kit I listed stated 1984-1996, but other than the direction the engine turns, I did not see anything else drastically different from the body of the 1997 or (in my case) the 1998 models. Would this conversion kit still work with how I intended?

[slonomo]

If it were me, I'd contact the Mfg about how close the frame is and if the engine mount plate is compatible. I have never owned a Club Car so I am no help in that area.

Regarding the engine choice, the Predator you are going with is a good engine and will be much more powerful than a stock engine. One thing you might look into is....can it be modified? I know the Predator 420 has a boat load of aftermarket support and is a "clone" of the Honda GX390. If you aren't going to mod the engine, no problem. I think you can get a different carb for both, and maybe some other parts might interchange. Just something to look at if it matters to you.

[raydhd]

One note here. The HF 459 doesn't have any aftermarket support. People on the 459 facebook site are having issues even getting stock replacement parts.Also note the crankshaft is supported by flat rather than ball bearings that the original honda 390 and clones of it use.

[jscola]

I have seen a lot about the Predator 420CC and its aftermarket support. When comparing to the 459CC, the 459CC came off to me as a slightly better version of the 420CC, for not much of an insane price increase.

I am hoping with the 459CC, and the gear ratio change I plan on doing in the transmission (either to an 8:1 or 6:1), that I can achieve the 40MPH goal.

I did, however, recently see a video on the 420CC, removing the governor, so I will have to look more into that, once I have officially decided. With this potential modification though, I am not sure if this will effect the throttle cable, or anything else related to that.

[raydhd]

My pick would be the Duromax 440 cc unit. It has replaceable shell bearings on the connecting rod,automotive type valve keepers, strongest block of all the single cylinder clones AND all the aftermarket speed equipment fits.